Good luck Less... I too hope you can prove 300w/hp.

Regards
Larry

Hello Ufo,
I built the motor with three pole motor, but it didn't work.
(Yes I have 7-pole and 3-pole scrap motors :-)
It did get stuck and starts oscillating the rotor.

I noticed to late that the brushes are perpendicular to the magnets.
(turned 90 clockwise with respect to your drawing).

Could you give me a tip how to connect the cables to the communitators to let it work?


ps. Checked the 7-pole, and it has the brushes perpendicular to the magnets as well!

Thanks,
Bert

Hello John,

Very wise words my friend...like you do always...many thanks!

I picture you as a very calm individual, that right in the middle of this fast running arguments and "electrifying" thread...sets a calmed sea of tranquility and recall Us all back to meditation and serene understanding...to analyze and perceive "things" with a very open mind...

To me, your comments here are like a "sedative", an Oasis of calm in the middle of a Desert Storm...and I thank you for it.

Yes John, I agree with you completely on above statement.


Warm Regards


Ufopolitics

You asked about Bob this morning and he is working this day on testing layers of CF in a large coil, copper-CF-copper-CF-copper with copper as one piece. Will know later today. I am working on a larger three pole as the RS-5 pole is done and done well I might add. When this is done, I plan to use the RS motor in one of my R/C gliders for testing later this summer. I would really like to get this larger 3 pole into my WACO YMF3. All that I care about is that it have enough torque to pull the WACO out of a flat spin. I so love to do flat spins. I must call him (Bob) now.
Dana

Hello Bbem,

Yes, I specified Brushes MUST be the way drawing shows...otherwise it will not work.

Just do it on each coil ends in the "Linearly" elements of both commutator elements...it is simple...1,2,3 upper all Coils start, and 1,2,3...All Coils ends...


1- Coil #1 (N-1), start wire attached to #1 Comm Element, opposed at 180 degrees, (as shown in Diagram) set as number One (1) Pole, write it down on Rotor Core exterior with a marker...

2-Do Coil # 2 (N-2), start wire attached to #2 Comm Element, opposed at 180 degrees of this Coil, and should be right next to the First one you started (N-1)

3- Do Three and done...well three is the last left...no options where else to connect...

Good luck, you will do it great


Light and regards


Ufopolitics

Hey Dave I really wish you the best of luck as well as anyone else trying the modification. At one time I think UFO said this modification would increase flight time of R/C model airplanes. A simple test would to use a prop adapter on the original Radio shack motor and maybe use something like a 9" prop. Record some different voltage, wattage and RPM data then match the RPM with the modified motor. If it takes less voltage and or wattage to match the RPM then you're getting somewhere. Just an idea that might be helpful.
John H

Hello DilJalaay,

Thanks You!

Yes, that could be done through Caps...however, not that simple, there must be a very efficient "logical" electronic circuit to "mediate" between Input to Motor versus Output to Cap Reservoir, and also a very well designed BMS (Battery Management System)

The problem is that we need a very well designed "Delayed Disbursement of Energy" at the time we disconnect Input from Power Source, enough to be able to supply the power Input at the precise momentum before armature will start decreasing RPM's...that "entering point" is the key to run by itself...

And also it depends on the type of machine you will be running...In a heavier armature we will use that Inertia Free Spinning Momentum of its great weight...to assist our Electronic Delay required...


As an example, we could look at this as an "Animation Curve" in a 3D Software...Time versus movements in three axis configuration....where we have an established and very well defined equilibrium when Machine is running normally at normal Input...therefore, in order for that "curve" not to start decaying when substituted by another one we want to replace with, we must do it very smoothly, and in the perfect angles to enter the "engaging substitution process"...we then need to travel together for a short time ...at same moves like there would be just one curve...then disconnect...


Think about the "re-fueling" process of an F-16 in the middle of the Air...The New Source to re-fuel it, and the F-16 must come to a perfect alignment of flight, where many parameters must meet an exact output between both Crafts, Speed, Acceleration, 3D Positioning, etc...to the point that if, we could be able to film that momentum, both planes would look like parked in solid grounds right next to each others...but they are traveling at 600-800 miles per hour...

A similar approach applies to make this operation of a "Self Running" Machine possible my dear friend...



Regards


Ufopolitics

Hi All

@UFO - thank you for your kind comments she looks good, but what a whiner!

I have run the motor for almost half an hour and noted some interesting things, with an oscilloscope attached.

As you will see in video, Initial Oscilloscope Test Part 1, the drive Battery voltage at the start (offload) is 9.58V, on load it quickly drops to 7.83V. The input however is only registering around 1V on the oscilloscope and the generator output is jumping about, which I think may be something to do with the brushes wearing in?

In the video-Initial Oscilloscope Test Part 2, which was taken about 25 mins later, you can see that the battery voltage has risen to 8.15V and the generator output seems settled. After 15 mins off the battery is now at 9.75V. Also the amp draw was initially at 1.15amps which at the end was about 0.8 amps.

What’s going on, or are my DMM and oscilloscope both sick?

Initial Oscilloscope Test Part 1 - YouTube

Initial Oscilloscope Test Part 2 - YouTube

Regards

John

My 3 motors just arrived today, I'd test them out right now, but I'm waiting for my multimeter to arrive. Still got to wait for my iron too so no point doing anything right now.

Dear John G,

No, Your measuring devices are perfectly fine John... (You seriously made me laugh out loud)

There is one thing you must realize here...This machines transfer the electrical flow (Both, Amperage and Voltage) very efficiently, while we obtain a great mechanical action...we are just getting our "Money Back" this time...and it does not get burnt inside the commutators...

We can't compare this Machines Performance (judge them) according to just Amps read out, this measurements will definitively "fool" Us all, and we will find many non sense readings...Let's check first what we are all looking for in a Motor Machine...their Mechanical power output...

So I will ask you John, to please conduct a Mechanical Load Test on that little Motor...get a piece of plastic or rubber and press it against the shaft...make it almost to get it to a stop (if you could be able to...lol)...while measuring all parameters...and let me know what you see...



Thanks much John


Regards


Ufopolitics

Hi UFO

Done test as requested.

battery initially off load 9.42v

I used a pair of smooth pliers, would be able to fully stop (I think) but it will draw up to 5amps+, so braked to 4amps. You will just burn your fingers if you use them as a brake.

Running unloaded:
Batt voltage 8.22V
Draw 0.8 amps
Motor 0.360 - 1.2v
Gen 800mv - 2.8v

Test loaded/braked to almost full stop

at 4 amps:
Batt 7.65v
volts motor 0.640-1.2v
volts gen 1.24v


Regards

John

It's not that great of a test, but I can easily stop the unmodified motor with a 9V battery attached

The modded motor is difficult to stop, I didn't stall it for mechanical sympathy.

regards

John

Hi John G,

Great work on your construction!

Really expresses your creativity.

Thanks for taking the time to test and post the results as well.

As we are moving into more and more testing, this comes to mind.

Here is a link to a Peter Lindemann video that spells out how to do the testing and calculations.

It gives great detail on how to do this.

If everybody follows this procedure, we will all be on the same page when comparing and discussing the results:

Peter Lindemann -- Electric Motor Secrets
Peter Lindemann -- Electric Motor Secrets - YouTube

IndianaBoys

Hello Dear friends!!


Exactly!! And great tests on you both Woopy and John G...

Well I believe...that what we are all looking for in a Motor...is not to read very high amperage measurements as our old school has taught Us...

But to measure what we actually need our Motors for...and that is...


///Power and Torque..Right?


I mean, correct me if I am wrong...

Or we could all set a very nice looking motor on top of my car, not connected , measuring 100 amps...and show everybody...call CNN...and all media...of my awesome scientific discovery...however, I could stop it with my middle finger...then it burns crispy...that was all he sang...
Is that a great deal there?




Regards friends, You guys are doing an excellent work here!!


Ufopolitics

IndianaBoys

Many thanks for that. You are right we should do a standard test for HP etc, however maybe UFO is alluding to energy transfer rather than pure HP. I will relook at PL's videos. Maybe this gets into the John Bedini sphere where maybe we cannot directly measure whats happening?

Regards

John

Hello Indiana Boys,


If I do that Dyno Test on my BOSCH Motor, ran with the same little battery...and not even recharged...it will brake Mr Lindemann's Scales...taking them apart...from their inner springs...I am as serious as a Heart attack.

The only reason why I have not made that Dyno test, is because of time...but I will.

That video was awesome, as I also recommend to watch it in its entirety...


Regards


Ufopolitics

We would all really appreciate that, thank you!

Les. Are you sure you don't have a multi-rotor drone that will fly for an hour in mind?
John H

Hi UfoPolitics,

Thanks for the quick reply.
And yes, I was as well thinking of pulsing the coils (which would give a bemf of course, not what we want). Thanks for telling us what you have tried. It helps us in thinking out of the box. I see you do, and hopefully more (others) will follow.
ps: if I were from Bosch, I would use your wiring scheme. The range of the scooter should go up. How many percent? 200%? More? I am curious .. ..

Turned the brush armature 90 degrees and it is running.
(Sorry didn't properly read the Ufo instructions on this)
Compared to the orignal motor it sounds more powefull with more rpm.
The original uses 200 mA the modified one 250 mA.

ps. I cheated because I used the original coils and soldered extra cable at the coils to attach them to the proper commutators.

Greeting from 'the Netherlands',
Bert

That's great Bbem...
But you are a "cheater"...

Now lazy guy...if you could go with Higher gauge wire and much more turns, as the embodiment allows... it could really do much better...


Regards



Ufopolitcs

Hello to All Replicants...

That sounded like from a Movie from Steven Spielberg...a "Replicant"...(kind of Robot made with specific Bio-Electronic Systems...


Anyways, I know you guys are winding like there is no tomorrow...
Except the Cheater of Bbem...

Therefore you may not notice small "details" about this set-up...

I have done this testings and they are beyond expectations...but there is a way to make it wrong connected...So I render this CAD Diagram...
NOTE: If you connect wrong the set up, it will counter effect the rotation when producing current...This would be a great test...then later on add Caps and watch the delay time after disconnecting Batteries...

It will be very obvious to say...that this Motors-Generators work much better by Oscillating-Controlling their speed Electronically...


[IMG][/IMG]



When You connect Face to Face, Generator Machine B is rotating "Counter" to Motor Machine A, therefore its Output would be opposite as it Normally was... ...Therefore, You must connect them the way I say...

Obviously, when Set-Up, is side to side...the Flow of Mechanical and therefore Electrical is in same direction...so it is connected then, as both Machines normal polarities...


Many Regards and Grrreat Testings!!


Ufopolitics

Hi UFO,

Theres some confusion on my end when it comes to the polarity of the connection in your motor-generator diagram. I thought the polarity of the asymmetrical motors was diagonal, or maybe that's just the case with the RS motor? I attached a image below..

Thanks

Attached Thumbnails

 

For those of you interested here are some test specs on the unmodified Radio Shack motor.

RadioShack® Super Speed 9-18VDC Hobby Motor
Model: 273-256 Catalog #: 273-256
This motor is perfect for solar power demonstrations, robotics, models, science projects and more. And it operates on three different voltage inputs: 9, 12 and 18V DC.
• No load: 9VDC 380mA current max., 11000± 15% speed, 150g.cm min. torque
• No load: 12VDC 400mA current max., 15200± 15% speed, 190g.cm min. torque
• No load: 18VDC 430mA current max., 24000± 15% speed, 290g.cm min. torque
• With load: 9VDC 1.1A current max., 9300± 15% speed
• With load: 12VDC 1.5A current max., 11500± 15% speed
• With load: 18VDC 2.4A current max., 18000± 15% speed
The motor is designed to run at 1.98 AMPS MAX!!
Recommend using 2 Amp Fuse.
MOUNTING INFO: Use METRIC Screws

Hi All

Ok, I have had the motor running for the last two hours – must switch off before the noise drives me insane! The motor has got quite warm/hot. Anyway, here are the battery voltage readings for the last 2 hours, amp draw has been about 700ma:

Start:1935hrs, 9.73v standing voltage
Switch on: 8.18v drop
8.14v /8.13v
8.14v/8.15v
8.11v/8.12v 1937hrs
8.10/8.11v 1945 hrs
8.12/8.13v 1947 hrs
8.10/8.11v 1951 hrs
8.12v 1955 hrs
8.14v 2013 hrs
8.13/8.14v 2033 hrs
8.10/8.11v 2125 hrs
8.09v 2135 hrs

It’s a real shame that the motor shaft is not longer, so as to attach a load, maybe generator as there is lots of torque. Will have a look tomorrow at the looping UFO showed.

Maybe someone could confirm these figures are normal or abnormal?

Regards

John

That diagram is showing it internally, the motor brushes causes it to be diagonal

Hey UFOpolitics, I think people when people are doing this it is just their native personality and everyone has their quirks and so best to ignore. And some people may want to show their intelligence and maybe gain a small bit of the glory here too by saying they understand it better but I'm sure it's obvious to most here that you not only have an extreme amount of builds under your belt but have done the research, hard study work and have a great understanding from your lab experience as well as research. I'd say you were Tesla reborn or the new 21st century Tesla but I wouldn't want to give you a fat head Some here like lamare are very strong on theory and may always want to share their knowledge but I think you are also very strong on theory and the difference is you are also very strong on actual lab experience. And we all know theory does not always equal real world experience.
Thanks again for all you are sharing here. I hope everyone continues to share in harmony here as it seems it has been so far 'cause this is BIG - very BIG in my opinion (for what that's worth).

__________________
There is no important work, there are only a series of moments to demonstrate your mastery and impeccability. Quote from Almine

Hi Ufo,
got other motors 24V from car wiper (manufacturer SWF).

2 magnets, 2 brushes, but strange: 8 poles.
No idea about the winding scheme

Is it necessary to replace this winding as well or can it be reconnected to the 2nd commutator?

BTW: I will check the DC generator from old VW beetle (have two of those cars in my garge). As far I remember the brush holder fits to the other side as well. Additionally it has a pulley for the belt so 2 of them can be connected very easily.

Thanks Ufo for your kind words above. We all got our intuition and skills on loan from the creator in order to share them in any community. Exactly that happens here in this thread. Warm thanks to all you guys!

__________________
Experts spend hours a day in order to question their doing while others stopped thinking feeling they were professionals.

Hi all

Hi Ufopolitics

After one day of great joy with looking this small motor spinning, i begin to go deeper in the reflection.

So the first question to ask at this point , and in my opinion, is not the power in versus the power out and , or comparison from the power of the original motor to the modified motor . (those basic question will be answered later )

But now i think that the main question is HOW CAN THIS MOTOR WORK???

here a small video about this question.

Will have a disturbed night, but that is is fantastic

good luck at all

laurent

Ufo assymetric motor part 2 - YouTube